(14-07-2025, 11:45 AM)Lilith7 Wrote: Ever more blatant about their vicious Neo Liberal agenda, this disgraceful govt is moving ever closer to privatised health. They're no longer bothering to disguise their quest for ever more profit.

Phil & Sue Bagshaw set up the charity hopsital here, & are well respected. I suspect if David Seymour attacks these two, he may be very surprised at the reaction.

Very clearly privatised health isn't in any way at all a good idea - apart from making money. I think they make an excellent point in that private health Drs will lack experience.
And there has been zero consultation on this issue - why not? Is it because most of us do NOT WANT privatised health?

Really, apart from some very, very wealthy people - does anyone want a privatised health system? Wouldn't we be better to pay a bit more tax, sufficient to cover health & education as some of the Scandinavian countries do.


Jack Tame, Q&A with Dr Sue Bagshaw & Dr Phil Bagshaw.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI1cYi69upI

(14-07-2025, 02:03 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: I don't understand this. Those who can afford private care can access it. Those who cannot have waiting lists.

Use private hospitals to clear the backlog, but do it on a short term basis and negotiate accordingly. If ACC can why can't Health?

Oh, and tax the rich.

(14-07-2025, 02:14 PM)heisenberg Wrote:

(14-07-2025, 11:45 AM)Lilith7 Wrote: Ever more blatant about their vicious Neo Liberal agenda, this disgraceful govt is moving ever closer to privatised health. They're no longer bothering to disguise their quest for ever more profit.

Phil & Sue Bagshaw set up the charity hopsital here, & are well respected. I suspect if David Seymour attacks these two, he may be very surprised at the reaction.

Very clearly privatised health isn't in any way at all a good idea - apart from making money. I think they make an excellent point in that private health Drs will lack experience.
And there has been zero consultation on this issue - why not? Is it because most of us do NOT WANT privatised health?

Really, apart from some very, very wealthy people - does anyone want a privatised health system? Wouldn't we be better to pay a bit more tax, sufficient to cover health & education as some of the Scandinavian countries do.


Jack Tame, Q&A with Dr Sue Bagshaw & Dr Phil Bagshaw.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI1cYi69upI

we already pAy enough tax its what its spent on that needs prioritised

(14-07-2025, 02:14 PM)heisenberg Wrote:

(14-07-2025, 11:45 AM)Lilith7 Wrote: Ever more blatant about their vicious Neo Liberal agenda, this disgraceful govt is moving ever closer to privatised health. They're no longer bothering to disguise their quest for ever more profit.

Phil & Sue Bagshaw set up the charity hopsital here, & are well respected. I suspect if David Seymour attacks these two, he may be very surprised at the reaction.

Very clearly privatised health isn't in any way at all a good idea - apart from making money. I think they make an excellent point in that private health Drs will lack experience.
And there has been zero consultation on this issue - why not? Is it because most of us do NOT WANT privatised health?

Really, apart from some very, very wealthy people - does anyone want a privatised health system? Wouldn't we be better to pay a bit more tax, sufficient to cover health & education as some of the Scandinavian countries do.


Jack Tame, Q&A with Dr Sue Bagshaw & Dr Phil Bagshaw.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI1cYi69upI

we already pAy enough tax its what its spent on that needs prioritised

(14-07-2025, 03:48 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote:

(14-07-2025, 02:14 PM)heisenberg Wrote: we already pAy enough tax its what its spent on that needs prioritised

We might, but do our wealthiest families do as well? Imagine what we could do if they did pay the same rate of taxation that the average person does!

Ask someone who has actually done those sums, researched the idea, and still advocates for it - 

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DMEkipWT2Md/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

(14-07-2025, 05:39 PM)heisenberg Wrote: make the maori corps, charity’s, religious corps  pay the same as everyone else as well then

it doesn’t matter how much tax is paid if its pissed away


https://thespinoff.co.nz/atea/18-03-2025/the-maori-economy-is-more-diverse-and-wealthier-than-ever#

(14-07-2025, 05:39 PM)heisenberg Wrote: make the maori corps, charity’s, religious corps  pay the same as everyone else as well then

it doesn’t matter how much tax is paid if its pissed away


https://thespinoff.co.nz/atea/18-03-2025/the-maori-economy-is-more-diverse-and-wealthier-than-ever#

(14-07-2025, 06:49 PM)harm_less Wrote:

(14-07-2025, 05:39 PM)heisenberg Wrote: make the maori corps, charity’s, religious corps  pay the same as everyone else as well then

it doesn’t matter how much tax is paid if its pissed away


https://thespinoff.co.nz/atea/18-03-2025/the-maori-economy-is-more-diverse-and-wealthier-than-ever#

I don't see anything in that Spinoff article to suggest Maori enterprises are paying less tax than any comparable businesses so I find your accusation disingenuous at best. If you can point us towards evidence to the contrary I'm open to reconsideration. 

Tax free status for churches is a whole different issue and I fully agree with them paying their fair share on their 'earnings'.

(14-07-2025, 06:52 PM)Lilith7 Wrote:

(14-07-2025, 06:49 PM)harm_less Wrote: I don't see anything in that Spinoff article to suggest Maori enterprises are paying less tax than any comparable businesses so I find your accusation disingenuous at best. If you can point us towards evidence to the contrary I'm open to reconsideration. 

Tax free status for churches is a whole different issue and I fully agree with them paying their fair share on their 'earnings'.

Best not hold your breath while waiting...

Agree with regard to churches; they need to be paying taxes.
Especially The Tamaki lot..

(14-07-2025, 08:11 PM)heisenberg Wrote:

(14-07-2025, 06:52 PM)Lilith7 Wrote: Best not hold your breath while waiting...

Agree with regard to churches; they need to be paying taxes.
Especially The Tamaki lot..

17.5%

https://www.ird.govt.nz/roles/maori-authorities

(15-07-2025, 09:02 AM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: And there is the cultural reason underpinning that status, like it or not.

Which isn't something the other privileged groups can claim.

(15-07-2025, 12:08 PM)heisenberg Wrote:

(15-07-2025, 09:02 AM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: And there is the cultural reason underpinning that status, like it or not.

Which isn't something the other privileged groups can claim.

so you Only want "other" people to pay more tax

(15-07-2025, 01:23 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: Well, a fair tax system would eliminate obvious disparities like billionaires paying a lower rate than the woman who cleans their bathrooms, surely?

But if creating that fairer system means I pay more, then okay, do that. I really do believe that having the income that means we pay taxes, is a privilege. Contributing to the community is a privilege. I don't understand this need some have to avoid it. For me that's just theft, plain and simple.

(15-07-2025, 03:18 PM)Lilith7 Wrote:

(15-07-2025, 12:08 PM)heisenberg Wrote: so you Only want "other" people to pay more tax

Fairly large assumption there...


I tend towards the view that everyone should pay tax in accordance with their income; someone on a large income pays more, those on low incomes will pay less so that everyone contributes.

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(15-07-2025, 01:23 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: Well, a fair tax system would eliminate obvious disparities like billionaires paying a lower rate than the woman who cleans their bathrooms, surely?

But if creating that fairer system means I pay more, then okay, do that. I really do believe that having the income that means we pay taxes, is a privilege. Contributing to the community is a privilege. I don't understand this need some have to avoid it. For me that's just theft, plain and simple.

Absolutely. Why anyone balks at helping others is something of a mystery, but I suspect teaching empathy in schools might help with that, eventually.