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+--- Thread: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... (/showthread.php?tid=1589)
Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - C_T_Russell - 11-10-2022
https://www.1news.co.nz/2022/10/11/live-jacinda-ardern-speaks-about-farming-emissions-plan/
This is going to be devastating, its such a crock of shit its not funny.
Like our small percentage of "emissions" is causing "extreme" weather events.
Jacinda openly says here that carbon neutral products will demand a higher price.
All ways to bribe farmers that this will be beneficial to them.
Who pays? YOU!
Expect more valuable farmland converted to shitty invasive pines.
Expect higher grocery prices.
What they dont tell you is that growing veges is just as "damaging" with fertilizier applied to the soil and all the constant years of turning over the soil, in fact its probably even worse.
They are even going after sheep farmers, its such BS its so hard to believe they are even wanting to do this.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - Oh_hunnihunni - 11-10-2022
(11-10-2022, 11:59 AM)C_T_Russell Wrote: https://www.1news.co.nz/2022/10/11/live-jacinda-ardern-speaks-about-farming-emissions-plan/Fact - agribusiness is responsible for half our emissions.
This is going to be devastating, its such a crock of shit its not funny.
Like our small percentage of "emissions" is causing "extreme" weather events.
Jacinda openly says here that carbon neutral products will demand a higher price.
All ways to bribe farmers that this will be beneficial to them.
Who pays? YOU!
Expect more valuable farmland converted to shitty invasive pines.
Expect higher grocery prices.
What they dont tell you is that growing veges is just as "damaging" with fertilizier applied to the soil and all the constant years of turning over the soil, in fact its probably even worse.
They are even going after sheep farmers, its such BS its so hard to believe they are even wanting to do this.
Fact - agribusiness currently pays a lot less for its climate damaging outcomes than other areas of business in this country.
Fact - we have committed to reduction targets with international agreements and treaties.
Fact - if we do not start taking climate change seriously we are risking our grandchildren's future.
Fact - this is a watered down version of what is really necessary.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - king1 - 11-10-2022
Have to agree with hunni, it is well overdue...
and I disagree with it necessarily inflating grocery prices, as we have seen recently supply and demand will always set the price. Farmers mostly have zero input in what they get paid for their produce... The market decides that.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - C_T_Russell - 11-10-2022
(11-10-2022, 12:03 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote:(11-10-2022, 11:59 AM)C_T_Russell Wrote: https://www.1news.co.nz/2022/10/11/live-jacinda-ardern-speaks-about-farming-emissions-plan/Fact - agribusiness is responsible for half our emissions.
This is going to be devastating, its such a crock of shit its not funny.
Like our small percentage of "emissions" is causing "extreme" weather events.
Jacinda openly says here that carbon neutral products will demand a higher price.
All ways to bribe farmers that this will be beneficial to them.
Who pays? YOU!
Expect more valuable farmland converted to shitty invasive pines.
Expect higher grocery prices.
What they dont tell you is that growing veges is just as "damaging" with fertilizier applied to the soil and all the constant years of turning over the soil, in fact its probably even worse.
They are even going after sheep farmers, its such BS its so hard to believe they are even wanting to do this.
Fact - agribusiness currently pays a lot less for its climate damaging outcomes than other areas of business in this country.
Fact - we have committed to reduction targets with international agreements and treaties.
Fact - if we do not start taking climate change seriously we are risking our grandchildren's future.
Fact - this is a watered down version of what is really necessary.
The fact is that our "emissions" are a drop in the bucket on a global scale and they will make no measureable impact at all when the rest of the world continues to burn coal and drive petrol cars.
Animals are part of nature and Africa has millions of wilderbeasts that are farting methane too but we wont be doing anything about that will we?
Farmers are an easy target by the govt and is purely for political gains to attract these uneducated voters who think its meaningful.
I would hate to think what these green ultra left wing nutjobs would do if they had free reign on this country, its scary!
Fact - growing veges is more damaging to soil than farming beef. Soil gets dug up and all the grass removed, then you still apply all the nitrates with synthetic fertilizer. Any organic grower will tell you to cover the soil.
We should be forcing vege growers to use regenerative methods too and require them to apply mulch.
All this BS about veges being better for the environment is crap.
The fact is this govt doesnt give a shit about the environment or else if they did, they would be banning palm oil and products containing palm oil, unless its from a sustainable operation that is verified to not be contributing to de-forestation.
We should be banning all these cheap crappy chinese imports that you get at K-Mart at the same time and be producing our own goods like in the old days where we didnt need to pay for shipping (in turn burning carbon) all this junk from china that just fills up our chinese owned landfills.
Dont get me started.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - Lilith7 - 11-10-2022
(11-10-2022, 12:03 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote:Far more is needed, but farmers are going to complain whether this affects them a little or a lot because they see it as their livelihoods being at stake. There are other methods of farming but change isn't easy & as farmers traditionally tend to vote right wing, its likely to only happen at a snail's pace & only whenever there's a left wing govt.(11-10-2022, 11:59 AM)C_T_Russell Wrote: https://www.1news.co.nz/2022/10/11/live-jacinda-ardern-speaks-about-farming-emissions-plan/Fact - agribusiness is responsible for half our emissions.
This is going to be devastating, its such a crock of shit its not funny.
Like our small percentage of "emissions" is causing "extreme" weather events.
Jacinda openly says here that carbon neutral products will demand a higher price.
All ways to bribe farmers that this will be beneficial to them.
Who pays? YOU!
Expect more valuable farmland converted to shitty invasive pines.
Expect higher grocery prices.
What they dont tell you is that growing veges is just as "damaging" with fertilizier applied to the soil and all the constant years of turning over the soil, in fact its probably even worse.
They are even going after sheep farmers, its such BS its so hard to believe they are even wanting to do this.
Fact - agribusiness currently pays a lot less for its climate damaging outcomes than other areas of business in this country.
Fact - we have committed to reduction targets with international agreements and treaties.
Fact - if we do not start taking climate change seriously we are risking our grandchildren's future.
Fact - this is a watered down version of what is really necessary.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - jim157 - 11-10-2022
just imagine if other countries included food production in their emission tally like virtue signalling aotearooooarrr does
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - harm_less - 11-10-2022
(11-10-2022, 03:53 PM)jim157 Wrote: just imagine if other countries included food production in their emission tally like virtue signalling aotearooooarrr doesThen we might actually start making positive progress in terms of climate change mitigation. Can't let the almighty dollar/euro/pound/yen/yuan get in the way of that though can we?
(11-10-2022, 12:21 PM)king1 Wrote: Have to agree with hunni, it is well overdue...Back 20 years or so when I was orcharding the industry journals were reporting that the return to growers was in the region of 10% of the supermarket prices for their produce. I'll bet little has changed in that regard and overall will have increased mainly as a result of (non-imported) labour rates, extreme climatic events and transportation (fuel) costs, all of which the farmer has very little control over, though the climate issue is one they are being forced to address by this governmental plan.
and I disagree with it necessarily inflating grocery prices, as we have seen recently supply and demand will always set the price. Farmers mostly have zero input in what they get paid for their produce... The market decides that.
The centralisation of supermarket warehousing has a lot to answer for in terms of the prices seen in the produce aisle.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - Zurdo - 11-10-2022
And now there is a shortage of Co2 - can't the farmers let the beer industry have some of their spare Co2 ?
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - jim157 - 11-10-2022
(11-10-2022, 04:23 PM)harm_less Wrote:(11-10-2022, 03:53 PM)jim157 Wrote: just imagine if other countries included food production in their emission tally like virtue signalling aotearooooarrr doesThen we might actually start making positive progress in terms of climate change mitigation. Can't let the almighty dollar/euro/pound/yen/yuan get in the way of that though can we?
(11-10-2022, 12:21 PM)king1 Wrote: Have to agree with hunni, it is well overdue...Back 20 years or so when I was orcharding the industry journals were reporting that the return to growers was in the region of 10% of the supermarket prices for their produce. I'll bet little has changed in that regard and overall will have increased mainly as a result of (non-imported) labour rates, extreme climatic events and transportation (fuel) costs, all of which the farmer has very little control over, though the climate issue is one they are being forced to address by this governmental plan.
and I disagree with it necessarily inflating grocery prices, as we have seen recently supply and demand will always set the price. Farmers mostly have zero input in what they get paid for their produce... The market decides that.
The centralisation of supermarket warehousing has a lot to answer for in terms of the prices seen in the produce aisle.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - Oh_hunnihunni - 11-10-2022
So, because there are heaps more murders elsewhere, it's okay for us to just off each other? The 'they're doing worse' argument is childish, and ill considered. It doesn't mean we get a free ride. Climate change is underway, it is man made, and every human being is going to be affected by it. Some a great deal more than others. We won't get off lightly, to even think we might is just magical thinking. Already we are seeing deaths and losses as a result right here, it is going to get a lot worse.
Now, this raft of proposals has come from consultation with those most affected, most involved, the stakeholders in agribusiness. Of course there will be screeching, all change is painful, for some more than others. This raft is also a very watered down version of what we really need to do. A compromise. And it isn't fixed in stone, plenty of time for discussion and more watering down, in fact, given a change of government we can pretty much guarantee that.
It is really self centred and probably just plain ignorant to whinge about these measures, which are after all designed to work to all our benefit. To save losses, lives, and the very real impact of an enormously changed world. But hey, we're old, we're lucky, we will probably escape the worst impacts because we'll be dead. Our kids, and theirs won't though.
I wonder what they will think of the legacy we are leaving them...
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - harm_less - 11-10-2022
(11-10-2022, 06:42 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: So, because there are heaps more murders elsewhere, it's okay for us to just off each other? The 'they're doing worse' argument is childish, and ill considered. It doesn't mean we get a free ride. Climate change is underway, it is man made, and every human being is going to be affected by it. Some a great deal more than others. We won't get off lightly, to even think we might is just magical thinking. Already we are seeing deaths and losses as a result right here, it is going to get a lot worse.Well said. You have the wisdom of age and a way with words m'lady.
Now, this raft of proposals has come from consultation with those most affected, most involved, the stakeholders in agribusiness. Of course there will be screeching, all change is painful, for some more than others. This raft is also a very watered down version of what we really need to do. A compromise. And it isn't fixed in stone, plenty of time for discussion and more watering down, in fact, given a change of government we can pretty much guarantee that.
It is really self centred and probably just plain ignorant to whinge about these measures, which are after all designed to work to all our benefit. To save losses, lives, and the very real impact of an enormously changed world. But hey, we're old, we're lucky, we will probably escape the worst impacts because we'll be dead. Our kids, and theirs won't though.
I wonder what they will think of the legacy we are leaving them...
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - SueDonim - 11-10-2022
(11-10-2022, 12:51 PM)C_T_Russell Wrote: The fact is that our "emissions" are a drop in the bucket on a global scale and they will make no measureable impact at all when the rest of the world continues to burn coal and drive petrol cars.
Animals are part of nature and Africa has millions of wilderbeasts that are farting methane too but we wont be doing anything about that will we?
Farmers are an easy target by the govt and is purely for political gains to attract these uneducated voters who think its meaningful.
I would hate to think what these green ultra left wing nutjobs would do if they had free reign on this country, its scary!
Fact - growing veges is more damaging to soil than farming beef. Soil gets dug up and all the grass removed, then you still apply all the nitrates with synthetic fertilizer. Any organic grower will tell you to cover the soil.
We should be forcing vege growers to use regenerative methods too and require them to apply mulch.
All this BS about veges being better for the environment is crap.
The fact is this govt doesnt give a shit about the environment or else if they did, they would be banning palm oil and products containing palm oil, unless its from a sustainable operation that is verified to not be contributing to de-forestation.
We should be banning all these cheap crappy chinese imports that you get at K-Mart at the same time and be producing our own goods like in the old days where we didnt need to pay for shipping (in turn burning carbon) all this junk from china that just fills up our chinese owned landfills.
Dont get me started.
Exactly.
We already have farmers planting pines for the stress free income. If all the farmers go away we will be importing even more food than we do now. That we import anything we can grow is ridiculous. People need to look at the bigger picture and let us be as self-sufficient as we can. Not force our primary producers out of business.
Yes, we need to deal with emissions, but cut the farmers some slack. They are our most important industry and many are already doing everything they can to reduce their environmental impact. It's the usual crap from Labour to hit the good with a sledgehammer to try and influence those who won't toe the line.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - jim157 - 12-10-2022
(11-10-2022, 06:42 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: So, because there are heaps more murders elsewhere, it's okay for us to just off each other? The 'they're doing worse' argument is childish, and ill considered. It doesn't mean we get a free ride.who said anything about a free ride, how about a even playing field
other countries dont include food production why should we "lead the world" in arderns words, all NZ leads the world in is murdering brown babies
what will our childrens children think.................why is food so expensive here , i cant afford to eat, thats probably what they will be thinking
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - Oh_hunnihunni - 12-10-2022
(12-10-2022, 05:14 AM)jim157 Wrote:Before I post the link you will not bother checking out, I have a question for you - Why is it you cannot post anything here without adding a racist twist?(11-10-2022, 06:42 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: So, because there are heaps more murders elsewhere, it's okay for us to just off each other? The 'they're doing worse' argument is childish, and ill considered. It doesn't mean we get a free ride.who said anything about a free ride, how about a even playing field
other countries dont include food production why should we "lead the world" in arderns words, all NZ leads the world in is murdering brown babies
what will our childrens children think.................why is food so expensive here , i cant afford to eat, thats probably what they will be thinking
https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/climate-news/130135307/will-the-governments-farming-emissions-plan-rip-the-guts-out-of-small-town-new-zealand
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - king1 - 12-10-2022
(12-10-2022, 05:14 AM)jim157 Wrote:or they might be thinking something along the lines of we're doomed...(11-10-2022, 06:42 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: So, because there are heaps more murders elsewhere, it's okay for us to just off each other? The 'they're doing worse' argument is childish, and ill considered. It doesn't mean we get a free ride.who said anything about a free ride, how about a even playing field
other countries dont include food production why should we "lead the world" in arderns words, all NZ leads the world in is murdering brown babies
what will our childrens children think.................why is food so expensive here , i cant afford to eat, thats probably what they will be thinking
- sea level risen by a meter
- average temps up 5 degrees
- uninsurable to natural events
- not enough food to support the worlds ever expanding population...
- reducing land mass to house the worlds ever expanding population...
Why the fuck didn't previous generations do more, sooner?
I absolutely know I don't want that to be my legacy... Price of food will be the least of their problems...
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - Oh_hunnihunni - 12-10-2022
I'll bet the people currently battling the flooding in Pakistan also would love a level playing field.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - Oldfellah - 12-10-2022
Fact - agribusiness is responsible for half our emissions.
Fact - agribusiness currently pays a lot less for its climate damaging outcomes than other areas of business in this country.
Fact - we have committed to reduction targets with international agreements and treaties.
Fact - if we do not start taking climate change seriously we are risking our grandchildren's future.
Fact - this is a watered down version of what is really necessary.
You forgot the most important one
Fact - our fairy stardust princess prime minister will be gone by lunchtime the day after election day.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - Oh_hunnihunni - 12-10-2022
(12-10-2022, 09:14 AM)Oldfellah Wrote: Fact - agribusiness is responsible for half our emissions.That is my personal horror movie...
Fact - agribusiness currently pays a lot less for its climate damaging outcomes than other areas of business in this country.
Fact - we have committed to reduction targets with international agreements and treaties.
Fact - if we do not start taking climate change seriously we are risking our grandchildren's future.
Fact - this is a watered down version of what is really necessary.
You forgot the most important one
Fact - our fairy stardust princess prime minister will be gone by lunchtime the day after election day.
But I remain optimistic that I will live to see a truly Green government.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - king1 - 12-10-2022
(12-10-2022, 09:14 AM)Oldfellah Wrote: Fact - agribusiness is responsible for half our emissions.and yet the climate crisis will still remain. It is a far bigger issue than petty politics
Fact - agribusiness currently pays a lot less for its climate damaging outcomes than other areas of business in this country.
Fact - we have committed to reduction targets with international agreements and treaties.
Fact - if we do not start taking climate change seriously we are risking our grandchildren's future.
Fact - this is a watered down version of what is really necessary.
You forgot the most important one
Fact - our fairy stardust princess prime minister will be gone by lunchtime the day after election day.
RE: Farm emission plan announced, expect to pay more for your food... - Lilith7 - 12-10-2022
(12-10-2022, 09:14 AM)Oldfellah Wrote: Fact - agribusiness is responsible for half our emissions.It clearly pleases you to try to make it personal, but you might want to consider that this has been coming for decades now ( I'm fairly sure that you might find it started well before the current PM was born) & humans have done appallingly little to try to fix the situation.
Fact - agribusiness currently pays a lot less for its climate damaging outcomes than other areas of business in this country.
Fact - we have committed to reduction targets with international agreements and treaties.
Fact - if we do not start taking climate change seriously we are risking our grandchildren's future.
Fact - this is a watered down version of what is really necessary.
You forgot the most important one
Fact - our fairy stardust princess prime minister will be gone by lunchtime the day after election day.
Things are now far more serious now than they were back in 1979, when then President Jimmy Carter put solar panels on the White house roof. Reagan removed them in 1986.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/carter-white-house-solar-panel-array/