03-03-2024, 11:27 AM
All well & good in principle to some extent, but the practice may be a very different thing. In particulay with younger gang members full of testosterone & lacking in life experience & self control.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/35019463...-and-mayor
"Gang patches: Views of a cop, gang member, lawyer and mayor
The new legislation would see all gang insignia banned in public places, would give police the power to issue ‘dispersal notices’ to gang members gathering in groups and to stop them communicating with each other. It would also allow judges to give more weight to gang membership as an aggravating factor at sentencing.
Police Commissioner Andrew Coster said the proposed law was "ambitious" and would would provide officers with further tools to “continue to put pressure on the gangs”, noting it would be up to officers to exercise their judgment about when to enforce it.
Police Association president Chris Cahill said "gang members aren't just going to hand over their patches“ and that policing the proposed law would be difficult in some areas. Some academics have been more critical. Associate law professor Carrie Leonetti called the proposed law a “political gimmick”.
The niggly bit, and it’s a niggle successive governments have struggled with since the days of Norman Kirk in the 1970s, is working out how to attenuate the impact and presence of gangs in a lawful and practical way.
To take a closer look at this we enter that allegorical bar in Hawke’s Bay, and speak to four people at the coalface.
First up is a Hawke’s Bay police officer with more that 15 years front-line experience, who is happy to speak provided he remains anonymous.
“I don’t think the general public appreciates just how much gang members disdain any form of authority, and especially police officers. I mean they really hate us.
“They’re ok when they’re by themselves or in a pair. They can be civil and compliant. But any more than two and they just wind each other up like a couple of teenagers egging each other on. They’re unpredictable, irrational and dangerous,” he said.
“Its really only the old, old school gang members who would be super compliant. They know how to play the game. The new generation are the problem. Full of bravado, showing off to each other. I think the last six years have seen them become way more emboldened.
A local gang member who would also not be identified said there was no way anyone would be taking his patch, or “korowai” (’cloak’), off him.
He said he was a law-abiding citizen, as were many of his fellow gang members. He said he understood that people felt intimidated by patches, but said these tended to be people who had little or no contact with gang members and were under the impression they were all violent and/or criminal.
“Give me an instance with all the tangi of recent where a member of the public has been harmed? It didn’t happen,” he said.
The man said there were more law-abiding gang members now “than ever before” and police would be best served by laws that allowed them to treat gangs like they did any other group.
Scott Jefferson, who’s been a defence lawyer in Hawke’s Bay since 1997, said the proposed law was “simply the whipping up of fears and insecurities in the wider public for political gain”.
“The Bill will inevitably fall foul of the NZ Bill of Rights Act 1990, particularly s17 - ‘Everyone has the right too freedom of association’. No wriggle room there,” he said.
Mayor Craig Little isn’t a fan of gang patches in public places, but feels there are more productive uses of police time and resources than targeting gang members for wearing their patches.
“The problem is that we associate the patches with crime. But not everyone wearing those patches is a bad bugger. They might be in a gang associated with crime, but I work with the local gangs and there’s a lot of them doing good stuff and trying to make it better for their families,” he said.
“Look, in an ideal world we wouldn’t have gangs, but we do, so we need to work with them. "
https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/35019463...-and-mayor
"Gang patches: Views of a cop, gang member, lawyer and mayor
The new legislation would see all gang insignia banned in public places, would give police the power to issue ‘dispersal notices’ to gang members gathering in groups and to stop them communicating with each other. It would also allow judges to give more weight to gang membership as an aggravating factor at sentencing.
Police Commissioner Andrew Coster said the proposed law was "ambitious" and would would provide officers with further tools to “continue to put pressure on the gangs”, noting it would be up to officers to exercise their judgment about when to enforce it.
Police Association president Chris Cahill said "gang members aren't just going to hand over their patches“ and that policing the proposed law would be difficult in some areas. Some academics have been more critical. Associate law professor Carrie Leonetti called the proposed law a “political gimmick”.
The niggly bit, and it’s a niggle successive governments have struggled with since the days of Norman Kirk in the 1970s, is working out how to attenuate the impact and presence of gangs in a lawful and practical way.
To take a closer look at this we enter that allegorical bar in Hawke’s Bay, and speak to four people at the coalface.
First up is a Hawke’s Bay police officer with more that 15 years front-line experience, who is happy to speak provided he remains anonymous.
“I don’t think the general public appreciates just how much gang members disdain any form of authority, and especially police officers. I mean they really hate us.
“They’re ok when they’re by themselves or in a pair. They can be civil and compliant. But any more than two and they just wind each other up like a couple of teenagers egging each other on. They’re unpredictable, irrational and dangerous,” he said.
“Its really only the old, old school gang members who would be super compliant. They know how to play the game. The new generation are the problem. Full of bravado, showing off to each other. I think the last six years have seen them become way more emboldened.
A local gang member who would also not be identified said there was no way anyone would be taking his patch, or “korowai” (’cloak’), off him.
He said he was a law-abiding citizen, as were many of his fellow gang members. He said he understood that people felt intimidated by patches, but said these tended to be people who had little or no contact with gang members and were under the impression they were all violent and/or criminal.
“Give me an instance with all the tangi of recent where a member of the public has been harmed? It didn’t happen,” he said.
The man said there were more law-abiding gang members now “than ever before” and police would be best served by laws that allowed them to treat gangs like they did any other group.
Scott Jefferson, who’s been a defence lawyer in Hawke’s Bay since 1997, said the proposed law was “simply the whipping up of fears and insecurities in the wider public for political gain”.
“The Bill will inevitably fall foul of the NZ Bill of Rights Act 1990, particularly s17 - ‘Everyone has the right too freedom of association’. No wriggle room there,” he said.
Mayor Craig Little isn’t a fan of gang patches in public places, but feels there are more productive uses of police time and resources than targeting gang members for wearing their patches.
“The problem is that we associate the patches with crime. But not everyone wearing those patches is a bad bugger. They might be in a gang associated with crime, but I work with the local gangs and there’s a lot of them doing good stuff and trying to make it better for their families,” he said.
“Look, in an ideal world we wouldn’t have gangs, but we do, so we need to work with them. "
in order to be old & wise, you must first be young & stupid. (I'm still working on that.)