(09-10-2025, 07:49 AM)C_T_Russell Wrote: Its Israel, its their land and they are going to eliminate hamas so they can live in peace.
I dont care for their religious beliefs, but growing up with a Christian background, i do know at least a bit on their history.

Its an ancient family feud that has been happening for many years.
There is nothing anyone can do on the outside to sort their shit out.
Im sick of the bad guys playing like the victim.

(09-10-2025, 12:23 PM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: History. Uh huh, like the fact jews and muslims lived peacefully side by side in Palestine for generations. As in hundreds and hundreds of years...

Till along came the Brits.

Funny how that story goes...

(09-10-2025, 11:52 AM)dken31 Wrote: C_T, I think you've fallen into the common trap of thinking we have to pick a side and that any conflict has a "good guy and a bad guy".  In this case, I firmly agree with Lilith7 that both "sides" are the bad guys, and i say "sides" as it is really just the leaders of both sides that are the bad guys, with the general populace on both sides being victims.

A few things to consider (and these are all documented facts, rather than being hearsay/speculation):
- the PLO was making significant progress towards a viable two-state solution before Hamas gained control (PLO had historically been a violent terrorist organisation, but had subsequently reformed)
- Netanyahu absolutely does not want a two-state solution under any circumstances
- Israel (Netanyahu) has provided significant funding to Hamas in recent years, facilitated via Qatar (this is accepted fact, not a conspiracy theory)
- The location of the music festival where the main attack took place changed locations only 2 days before the attack, with many people saying hardly anyone would have gone had they originally known it would be so close to the Gaza border (i.e. they only still went because they'd already bought tickets)
- Israel has excellent security/intelligence systems, yet didn't manage to pre-empt the October 7th attack, and then took several hours to get troops on the ground, despite the attacks being only a 30min helicopter flight from the main IDF base in Tel Aviv
- Israel (Netanyahu) have subsequently relied on Oct 7th as justification for the annihilation of Gaza

Applying basic logic, the natural conclusion drawn from the known facts is that if Israel (Netanyahu) didn't actually organise the attack on themselves, they at least deliberately chose to let it happen and for it to be bad enough so as to "justify" wiping out Gaza and its occupants.

(09-10-2025, 02:44 PM)C_T_Russell Wrote:

(09-10-2025, 11:52 AM)dken31 Wrote: C_T, I think you've fallen into the common trap of thinking we have to pick a side and that any conflict has a "good guy and a bad guy".  In this case, I firmly agree with Lilith7 that both "sides" are the bad guys, and i say "sides" as it is really just the leaders of both sides that are the bad guys, with the general populace on both sides being victims.

A few things to consider (and these are all documented facts, rather than being hearsay/speculation):
- the PLO was making significant progress towards a viable two-state solution before Hamas gained control (PLO had historically been a violent terrorist organisation, but had subsequently reformed)
- Netanyahu absolutely does not want a two-state solution under any circumstances
- Israel (Netanyahu) has provided significant funding to Hamas in recent years, facilitated via Qatar (this is accepted fact, not a conspiracy theory)
- The location of the music festival where the main attack took place changed locations only 2 days before the attack, with many people saying hardly anyone would have gone had they originally known it would be so close to the Gaza border (i.e. they only still went because they'd already bought tickets)
- Israel has excellent security/intelligence systems, yet didn't manage to pre-empt the October 7th attack, and then took several hours to get troops on the ground, despite the attacks being only a 30min helicopter flight from the main IDF base in Tel Aviv
- Israel (Netanyahu) have subsequently relied on Oct 7th as justification for the annihilation of Gaza

Applying basic logic, the natural conclusion drawn from the known facts is that if Israel (Netanyahu) didn't actually organise the attack on themselves, they at least deliberately chose to let it happen and for it to be bad enough so as to "justify" wiping out Gaza and its occupants.

Im pretty sure Netanyahu has publicly said he supports a two state solution.
But hey some good news, it appears that Hamas has agreed to trumps peace plan.

Meanwhile all Chloe wants to talk about is Palestine and gender identity while ignoring the homeless in her very own  electorate.

(09-10-2025, 02:44 PM)C_T_Russell Wrote:

(09-10-2025, 11:52 AM)dken31 Wrote: C_T, I think you've fallen into the common trap of thinking we have to pick a side and that any conflict has a "good guy and a bad guy".  In this case, I firmly agree with Lilith7 that both "sides" are the bad guys, and i say "sides" as it is really just the leaders of both sides that are the bad guys, with the general populace on both sides being victims.

A few things to consider (and these are all documented facts, rather than being hearsay/speculation):
- the PLO was making significant progress towards a viable two-state solution before Hamas gained control (PLO had historically been a violent terrorist organisation, but had subsequently reformed)
- Netanyahu absolutely does not want a two-state solution under any circumstances
- Israel (Netanyahu) has provided significant funding to Hamas in recent years, facilitated via Qatar (this is accepted fact, not a conspiracy theory)
- The location of the music festival where the main attack took place changed locations only 2 days before the attack, with many people saying hardly anyone would have gone had they originally known it would be so close to the Gaza border (i.e. they only still went because they'd already bought tickets)
- Israel has excellent security/intelligence systems, yet didn't manage to pre-empt the October 7th attack, and then took several hours to get troops on the ground, despite the attacks being only a 30min helicopter flight from the main IDF base in Tel Aviv
- Israel (Netanyahu) have subsequently relied on Oct 7th as justification for the annihilation of Gaza

Applying basic logic, the natural conclusion drawn from the known facts is that if Israel (Netanyahu) didn't actually organise the attack on themselves, they at least deliberately chose to let it happen and for it to be bad enough so as to "justify" wiping out Gaza and its occupants.

Im pretty sure Netanyahu has publicly said he supports a two state solution.
But hey some good news, it appears that Hamas has agreed to trumps peace plan.

Meanwhile all Chloe wants to talk about is Palestine and gender identity while ignoring the homeless in her very own  electorate.

(10-10-2025, 07:41 AM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: He is going to be so pissed off when Greta gets it. (Fingers crossed).

(10-10-2025, 09:32 AM)heisenberg Wrote:

(10-10-2025, 07:41 AM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: He is going to be so pissed off when Greta gets it. (Fingers crossed).

is there a prize for having a terrible haircut?

(10-10-2025, 09:34 AM)Praktica Wrote:

(10-10-2025, 09:32 AM)heisenberg Wrote: is there a prize for having a terrible haircut?

Is that how Trump is going to win it?

(10-10-2025, 07:41 AM)Oh_hunnihunni Wrote: He is going to be so pissed off when Greta gets it. (Fingers crossed).

(10-10-2025, 09:59 AM)heisenberg Wrote:

(10-10-2025, 09:34 AM)Praktica Wrote: Is that how Trump is going to win it?

pretty sure trump has done more to stop the war than virtue than signalling  doomgoblin

(11-10-2025, 11:54 AM)C_T_Russell Wrote: Winston made a good point the other day that the majority of countries not recognizing Palestine are Muslim countries, what does that tell you?

(11-10-2025, 11:54 AM)C_T_Russell Wrote: Winston made a good point the other day that the majority of countries not recognizing Palestine are Muslim countries, what does that tell you?

(11-10-2025, 01:04 PM)king1 Wrote:

(11-10-2025, 11:54 AM)C_T_Russell Wrote: Winston made a good point the other day that the majority of countries not recognizing Palestine are Muslim countries, what does that tell you?

what do you think CT?
about a third of the way down the page - States that do not recognise Palestine
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_recognition_of_Palestine

How many of them are 'Muslim' countries...

(11-10-2025, 01:39 PM)C_T_Russell Wrote:

(11-10-2025, 01:04 PM)king1 Wrote: what do you think CT?
about a third of the way down the page - States that do not recognise Palestine
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_recognition_of_Palestine

How many of them are 'Muslim' countries...

Im sure Winston quoted Egypt

(11-10-2025, 01:42 PM)harm_less Wrote:

(11-10-2025, 01:39 PM)C_T_Russell Wrote: Im sure Winston quoted Egypt

If you're sure of it then it shouldn't be too difficult for you to find the relevant quote.