(20-05-2023, 06:12 PM)king1 Wrote: Seriously, how far do you think the money will really go, paid to "the far too many whose laziness and greed is just taking money away from where it's really needed" ?
Even if ALL the unemployed in NZ (currently around 102,000) are the lazy yobs you make them out to be, that is probably only 30-40 million... Not really sure that will be enough to "afford the levels of health etc that we theoretically have paid for." It's a drop in the bucket...
I wasn't really meaning those on unemployment benefit. By definition they are looking for work. It's all the others. The need for sickness and disability benefits for people who do really need them is greatly clouded by those who sit on benefits doing nothing useful when they could actually be a lot happier and healthier if they overcame some discomfort and got up and out. It's a serious social problem that is just getting worse.
But even if only $30-$40m was saved, it would still be more useful to everyone, even those with the most need if it were invested somewhere useful, like health, education, roads, etc.
(20-05-2023, 07:25 PM)Lilith7 Wrote: I'm well aware you used the usual disclaimer of there being 'some who really need help in the form of benefits.' But as usual, while also disparaging all those on benefits by implying that there are plenty who could do better.
There aren't 'plenty' - too many people are seriously struggling these days.
I'm really not at all sure exactly why it is that some people insist that people aren't contributing to society, are effectively 'giving nothing back' since I'd imagine that those cast aside & continually disparaged by society might just possibly be ever so slightly reluctant to do so & with some justification.
But the reality is that almost everyone does in some way contribute to society, however small that may be.
And seriously - 'the hard working rich?!' No doubt working out exactly how much more they can squeeze from their tenants without them giving notice could be a tricky thing to work out for those landlords..
As it happens though I'd rather see us all pay more tax; imo we should as far as possible emulate those Nordic countries which have high taxes which cover things like health & education etc. etc. & whose people are invariably at the top of those happiest people surveys.
"disparaging all those on benefits by implying that there are plenty who could do better". I'm not disparaging anyone who needs a benefit, just trying to get through that many who have benefits don't actually have a real need. The biggest disparagement going on here is that of those who have worked for what they have and have paid their taxes and therefore their dues to society, but are somehow greedy just because the reward for their work has been a comfortable lifestyle.
"But the reality is that almost everyone does in some way contribute to society, however small that may be". The majority of people do, but there are plenty who only fill the coffers of KFC or the local pub.
And then you get back to disparagaing landlords again. Think about how bad the housing problem would be without any rentals.